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Frequently Asked Questions (FAQS);faqs.096



15a.There are two ways to get scuba related mail.  Both involve the
    bitnet listserv system, and both are run from Brown University.
    The LISTSERV administrator there is Catherine Yang, but these
    things are designed to be administered automatically.  The two
    lists are scuba-d, which holds the scuba digests that are
    constructed from the postings to rec.scuba, and scuba-l which is a
    completely independent scuba related discussion list.

    You never send subscribe or unsubscribe requests to the address of
    the list.  In fact, if you do, they will be relayed to all of the
    people who get stuff from the list (and probably ignored).  To
    sign onto or sign off from a listserv list, you send mail to
    userid LISTSERV.  For example, to sign on to scuba-d so that you
    still get the rec.scuba postings, send mail to
    [e-mail], with the text:

    SUB scuba-d your name

    You must replace the string 'your name' with your own name.  To
    subscribe to scuba-l, send the same message, but replace scuba-d
    with scuba-l.

    To find out more about how to use the listserv system, send mail
    to LISTSERV with a text line that says 'HELP'.  For your
    convenience, the response to a HELP command is reproduced below.

    If you don't have the ability to post to rec.scuba locally, you
    can mail your postings to [e-mail].

  Revised LISTSERV version 1.7c -- most commonly used commands

  Info      <topic|?>              Get detailed information files
  List      <Detail|Short|Global>  Get a description of all lists
  SUBscribe listname <full_name>   Subscribe to a list
  SIGNOFF   listname               Sign off from a list
  SIGNOFF   * (NETWIDE             - from all lists on all servers
  REView    listname <options>     Review a list
  STats     listname <options>     Review list statistics
  Query     listname               Query personal distribution options
  SET       listname  options      Set personal distribution options
  INDex     <filelist_name>        Obtain a list of LISTSERV files
  GET       filename filetype      Obtain a file from LISTSERV
  REGister  full_name|OFF          Tell LISTSERV about your name

  There are more commands (AFD, FUI, PW, etc). Send an INFO REFCARD
  for a complete reference card,  or INFO ? for a list of available
  documentation files.

  Postmasters are:
   Peter DiCamillo / ListMaint <CMSMAINT@BROWNVM>
--
Nick Simicich - uunet!bywater!scifi!njs - [e-mail]
SSI #AOWI 3958, HSA 318, NAUI #14065
Join the movement ---  turn 'to bush' into a verb.
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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Rec.arts.sf groups, an introduction
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: rec.arts.sf.misc
Summary: Last modified Jul 6 1992
Sender: [e-mail] (Scott Hazen Mueller)
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Archive-name: sf-groups-intro

Send questions and updates or comments to: [e-mail].

            What is rec.arts.sf.*?
  Rec.arts.sf.* (r.a.sf.*) is a set of newsgroups devoted to discussion
of SF, in its rather broad meaning of "speculative fiction", including
both science fiction and fantasy, as well as that vast blurred mass of
material in between (to steal a phrase from the call for votes that
caused the creation of these groups).

        So what groups are there, anyway?
Here's a short, one-line-per-group listing of the groups:

rec.arts.sf.misc    Replaces rec.arts.sf-lovers as the catch-all
rec.arts.sf.announce     Announcements (moderated: [e-mail])
rec.arts.sf.fandom    Fannish activities, cons, etc.
rec.arts.sf.marketplace    Personal for-sale notices
rec.arts.sf.movies    SF movies that don't have their own groups
rec.arts.sf.reviews    A renaming of rec.arts.sf-reviews.  (Moderated.)
rec.arts.sf.science    Science and theory related to sf
rec.arts.sf.starwars    Star wars, books, movies, etc
rec.arts.sf.tv        SF tv shows that don't have their own groups
rec.arts.sf.written    Novels, stories, etc.


        More specific information, please.
  Some of those one-liners might not be very clear...which is why the
original charters of the groups are included here as well.  They show
the intent of the people who advocated most strongly for them.
  (Charters follow at end of article.)

        Other newsgroups of interest to SF fans
  For Dr. Who fans, there's a newsgroup specifically for discussions
about the movies, the show, and anything and everything related to Dr.
Who: rec.arts.drwho.
  For Star Trek fans, there are several groups:
  rec.arts.startrek.info.  A distillation of news and information
about Star Trek, including synopses of new episodes, convention
reports, station airing times around the US and the world, and other
tidbits of factual information about Trek.  Moderated: send submissions
to [e-mail]; questions or comments should be sent to
[e-mail].
  rec.arts.startrek.current, r.a.s.fandom, r.a.s.tech, and r.a.s.misc
were recently created.  There is a monthly information posting in those
groups (and in news.answers, eventually) which describes all of r.a.startrek
in detail.
  For Cyberpunk: alt.cyberpunk.  There's also alt.cyberpunk.chatsubo,
virtual reality via prose interaction.
  Fandom has its own groups, as well: alt.fandom.cons and alt.fandom.misc.
  For Pern fans, look in alt.fan.pern.
  Other alt.fan.* groups: alt.fan.douglas-adam, alt.fan.pratchett,
alt.fan.eddings, alt.fan.piers-anthony, alt.fan.asprin

rec.arts.sf.misc
     Charter: Group rec.arts.sf.misc will be the general-purpose
              and spillover group for science fiction and fantasy
          discussions that do not find a more specific subgroup
          under rec.arts.sf.*, or that would otherwise require
          wide crossposting among the other subgroups.

rec.arts.sf.announce (moderated, <[e-mail]>)
     Charter: (moderated) Announcements of happenings in the
              SF world, such as cons, including calls for con
              participation, readings, deaths, honors, new SF
              mailing lists, periodic postings of rec.arts.sf
              subgroup charters and other administrivia,
              signings, TV specials, meetings, shop openings and
              closings, etc. Not for personal or commercial ads.
     Send submissions to: [e-mail]; questions to
    the moderator address above.

rec.arts.sf.fandom
     Charter: Discussions of fannish activities; meant to provide
              a new home for the SF-related part of the traffic
              currently posted to alt.fandom.* and similar
              postings current in rec.arts.sf-lovers.

rec.arts.sf.marketplace
     Charter: A place for personal wanted-to-buy and for-sale ads
              for SF related materials.  Personal ads only;
              commercial ads belong in comp.newprod or commercial
              advertising channels, not elsewhere on USENet.  Do
              NOT crosspost ads; those looking to buy or sell SF
              stuff will be reading this group and just annoyed
              by ads mixed in elsewhere.

rec.arts.sf.movies
     Charter: Discussions of all aspects of SF related movies not
              otherwise covered in more specific groups (such as
              the Star Trek group).  Specifically includes
              screenplays looking for producers, and discussions
              of novelizations as compared to the movie base;
              discussion of novelizations independent of the
              related movie belong in .written.

rec.arts.sf.reviews (moderated)
     Revies of SF books and movies.  There are six moderators, total.
    Send submissions to: [e-mail].

rec.arts.sf.science
     Charter: A home for the spinoff discussion of real and
              speculative science and sometimes about how the
              laws of science could be used in creating new SF
              universes.

rec.arts.sf.tv
     Charter: A group for discussing general television SF, both
              live acted and cartoons.  Note that some tv shows,
          (such as Dr. Who and Star Trek) have their own
          specialized newsgroups as well.

rec.arts.sf.written
     Charter: A group for discussing the general SF which is seen
              by its audience in written form, whether printed or
              online.  Note that many more specific groups in
              rec.arts.sf.* exist to pull some traffic from this
              group, but in general, this is where new releases
              are discussed, informal reviews given, continuity
              topics discussed, authors compared, and is the
              starting point for many threads which should
              eventually be moved to more appropriate groups.
              (Please cooperate when the call is put forward to
              move a discussion to a more specific group.)


Leanne Phillips
"Do not meddle with the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick
to anger."  (I don't want to hear other versions.  I've heard them all before.)
Words to live by: "Violence is the refuge of the incompetent."
    (Yes, I know it isn't right; it's deliberate.)

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From: [e-mail] (Evelyn C. Leeper)
Subject: rec.arts.sf.movies Frequently Asked Questions
Expires: Thu, 25 Mar 1993 22:36:43 GMT
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Copies of this article may be obtained by anonymous ftp to
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/pub/usenet/news.answers/sf-movies-faq.Z.  Or, send email to
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Last change:
Tue Aug 11 10:37:43 EDT 1992

Contents:
     1. Star Trek.
     2. The animated LORD OF THE RINGS by Ralph Bakshi covers only the
        first half of the trilogy.  Bakshi did not make the second half.
     3. Frequent subjects.
     4. Abbreviations commonly used in this group:
     5. BLADE RUNNER: the sixth replicant, why voice-overs, and Deckard a
        replicant?
     6. "Can the X beat the Y?" where X and Y are mighty ships or alien
        races from different space opera movies/series.
     7. Is the movie HEAVY METAL out on video?
     8. Why is there an acknowledgment to Harlan Ellison in the credits of
        THE TERMINATOR?  or  Doesn't THE TERMINATOR have the same plot as a
        TWILIGHT ZONE episode?
     9. What about the relationship between HAL (the computer in 2001: A
        Space Odyssey) and IBM?  (If you add 1 to each letter in HAL you get
        IBM.)
    10. Who was the voice of the seductive Jessica Rabbit in the film
        "WHO FRAMED ROGER RABBIT"?
    11. What are all of the "cute" gimmicks in the film BACK TO THE
        FUTURE?
    12. What role did Jamie Lee Curtis play in THE ADVENTURES OF
        BUCKAROO BANZAI ACROSS THE 8TH DIMENSION?
    13. When is George Lucas going to make more STAR WARS films?  What
        will they be about??
    14. In OUTLAND and TOTAL RECALL, astronauts exposed to vacuum
        promptly explode.  In 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY, a few seconds'
        exposure to vacuum doesn't bother one at all.  Which is right?
    15. What does "FTL" mean?
    16. I was told that the director's cut of DUNE was seven hours long,
        and did a much better job of portraying the novel.  Where can I
        find it?
    17. What are the two minutes of new footage on the STAR TREK VI: THE
        UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY videocassette?

---------------------------------------------------------------------
rec.arts.sf.movies is a newsgroup devoted to discussions of science
fiction, horror, and fantasy movies.  It is a high-volume newsgroup and
this article is intended to help reduce the number of unnecessary
postings, thereby making it more useful and enjoyable to everyone.

If you have not already done so, please read the articles in
news.announce.newusers.  They contain a great deal of useful information
about network etiquette and convention.

Before we begin, two pieces of net.etiquette.  Both of these are
mentioned in news.announce.newusers, but since they are so frequently
violated, and at least one of them is particularly relevant to this
group, we mention them here:

SPOILER WARNINGS:  Many people feel that much of the enjoyment of a film
is ruined if they know certain things about it, especially when those
things are surprise endings or mysteries.  On the other hand, they also
want to know whether or not a film is worth seeing, or they may be
following a particular thread of conversation where such information may
be revealed.  The solution to this is to put the words SPOILER in your
header, or in the text of your posting.  You can also put a ctl-L
character in the *first* column if you are using rn.  Some people think
that spoiler warnings are not necessary.  We don't understand why, and do
not want to discuss it.  Use your best judgment.

REPLIES TO REQUESTS AND QUESTIONS:  When you think that many people will
know an answer to a question, or will have an answer to a request,
RESPOND VIA E-MAIL!!!  And if you don't know the answer, but want to
know, DON'T POST TO THE NET asking for the answer, ask VIA E-MAIL!  If
you think a lot of people will want the same information, you might
suggest that the person summarize to the net.

Even if you don't see an answer posted, and you have the answer, please
send it e-mail.  The thirty other people who answered may have already
sent it, and your site just hasn't gotten it yet.  It clogs the net and
gets very tedious to see 30 people answer the same question, and another
30 people asking for the answer to be posted.  All of that should be
done via mail.  The net is a highly asynchronous medium.  It can take
several days for an article to make it to all sites.  It is also quite
common for followups to messages to reach a site before the original.

There is also a FAQ list posted to rec.arts.movies which covers more
general topics and includes the location of many useful databases.  And
finally, there is a group, rec.arts.movies.reviews, that carries reviews
of both SF and non-SF movies.

Please keep in mind two points:

    1.  Always remember that there is a live human being at the
    other end of the wires.  In other words, please write your
    replies with the same courtesy you would use in talking to
    someone face-to-face.

    2.  Try to recognize humor and irony in postings.  Tone of
    voice does not carry in ASCII print, and postings are often
    snapped off quickly, so that humorous intent may not be
    obvious.  More destructive and vicious arguments have been
    caused by this one fact of net existence than any other.  It
    will help if satiric/ironic/humorous comments are marked with
    the "smiley face," :-)


Below is a summary of questions and subjects which appear frequently in
this group.  Please read it before posting anything to rec.arts.sf.movies.


1. Star Trek.

There is a hierarchy for Star Trek, rec.arts.startrek.  If you have
access to netnews, use it for discussions about any Star Trek subject
(old series, new series, movies, novels, etc.).  If you are absolutely
sure you cannot access the startrek newsgroups, and you *must* post to
rec.arts.sf.movies, include the phrase "Star Trek" in the subject line.

Do not post flames about people violating this guideline.  Use e-mail
to request they follow it.  It's likely that this person is reading
rec.arts.sf.movies via a gateway and has no access to netnews or
rec.arts.startrek.


2. The animated LORD OF THE RINGS by Ralph Bakshi covers only the
   first half of the trilogy.  Bakshi did not make the second half.

There was a completely independently produced animation of THE RETURN
OF THE KING by Rankin/Bass who also did an animation of THE HOBBIT.

(Someone notes that Tolkien deplored the fact that the "Lord of the
Rings" is considered a trilogy.  That's as may be, but I'm afraid
we're stuck with the terminology.)


3. Frequent subjects.

Some subjects have been discussed numerous times in this group.  Please
consider carefully before starting discussions on these topics.

    1. Casting your favorite book as a movie.
    2. The Ten Best SF Movies
    3. What SF books would make good movies and, conversely,
       why sf movies from books are usually not very good.


4. Abbreviations commonly used in this group:
    BTW  -- "By the way"
    FYI  -- "For your information"
    IMAO -- "In my arrogant opinion"
    IMHO -- "In my humble (honest) opinion"
    ROTF -- "Rolling on the floor"
    ROFL -- "Rolling on the floor, laughing"
    RPG  -- "Role playing games", like D&D (Dungeons and Dragons)
    wrt  -- "with respect to"


5. BLADE RUNNER: the sixth replicant, why voice-overs, and Deckard a
   replicant?

In an early scene of BLADE RUNNER, there is mention of six replicants.
However, they only account for five of them in the course of the movie.

The consensus of the net is that there was a change in the script after
that scene was shot and they forgot to dub over it.

Some people have contended that the initial plan in this movie was
to have the plot proceed without any explanation.  However,
test/preview audiences found it hard to understand (or, the makers
of the film *thought* audiences would find it hard to understand).
So, they added the voice-overs.  It seems that the general
consensus among the net is that they don't like the voice-overs,
although occasionally a dissenting voice is heard from the woods.

Is Deckard really a replicant?  This is the classic
"over-discussed" topic.  Some people say that there are clues in
the film (still BLADE RUNNER) that Deckard is not human.  What are
they?

Kouhia Juhana Krister ([e-mail]) says that in the director's
version there are several clues (for example, a unicorn dream scene and
a paper unicorn at the end of the movie) that tell that Deckard is a
replicant.  Movie ends when Deckard and Rachel enter the elevator.  In
the final version, however, all clues which tell that Deckard is a
replicant have been edited out (as much as possible).  Some clues still
exist but Deckard is not meant to be a replicant.  An extra scene has
been added to the end of the movie.  Both versions have a happy ending,
but in the director's version Deckard and Rachel will die when their
four-year lifetime expires.

In regard to the above questions, Michael Kaufman ([e-mail])
mentions a book titled RETROFITTING BLADERUNNER, "full of articles about
the film and containing more information then anyone could possibly
want."

Now that the director's cut has been released, this argument will
undoubtedly gain new life.


6. "Can the X beat the Y?" where X and Y are mighty ships or alien
    races from different space opera movies/series.

These kind of discussions are fairly pointless.  Please keep them off the
net.


7. Is the movie HEAVY METAL out on video?

No and yes.  Due to legal problems, it has not been officially released.
There are a number of bootleg copies in circulation, though.


8. Why is there an acknowledgment to Harlan Ellison in the credits of
   THE TERMINATOR?  or  Doesn't THE TERMINATOR have the same plot as a
   TWILIGHT ZONE episode?

(The following answer is taken from a posting by Jerry Boyajian.)

Ellison filed suit against the studio claiming that THE TERMINATOR
was plagiarized from his two teleplays for THE OUTER LIMITS. One was
"Soldier" (based on a short story he written years before), in which
a soldier is zapped from a future war zone into the present and causes
all sorts of problems. In addition to basic plot similarities, the
scenes of the future in THE TERMINATOR are very similar in look and
feel to those in "Soldier".

The other teleplay was "Demon With a Glass Hand", in which a lone man
with a glass-and-computer-chips hand and a woman he meets up with are
on the run from some unknown enemy. He has amnesia and doesn't know a
thing about who he is, or why he's in his current situation. Eventually,
he finds out that he's from the future and was sent to the present on
a mission to save the human race.

Separately, I feel that THE TERMINATOR is a legitimate variation on the
ideas presented in Ellison's stories. However, taken together, it would
seem as if James Cameron got the idea from Ellison's stories, in which
case, Ellison is owed something. At any rate, as the story goes, the
studio was going to fight the suit, but in preparing their defense, they
found out from someone in the production crew that Cameron had quipped
on the set about how he'd "ripped off a couple of OUTER LIMITS episodes".
At that point, they decided to settle out of court, giving Ellison some
undisclosed amount of money and inserting the credit.

(Thomas Pluck ([e-mail]) adds the following:)

You left out one important thing with the Ellison/Cameron suit; the
concept of Skynet, the military supercomputer that sees all humanity as
the enemy, was taken from Ellison's short story "I Have No Mouth and I
Must Scream," collected in the book of the same name and various other
SF anthologies.  Ellison's computer called itself AM, and it kept five
people alive to  torture for all eternity because it hated its creators
so much.  The two OUTER LIMITS scripts plus that short story are half or
more of the TERMINATOR plot.


9. What about the relationship between HAL (the computer in 2001: A
   Space Odyssey) and IBM?  (If you add 1 to each letter in HAL you get
   IBM.)

According to Clarke, this relationship is entirely accidental.  In
fact, he claims that if he had been aware of it, he would have chosen a
different name for his computer.  (HAL stands for Heuristic ALgorithmic.)

10. Who was the voice of the seductive Jessica Rabbit in the film
    "WHO FRAMED ROGER RABBIT"?

This is sort of a trick question, because there are TWO voices.
Kathleen Turner provided the speaking voice, and Amy Irving did the
singing.


11. What are all of the "cute" gimmicks in the film BACK TO THE
    FUTURE?

Apparently, the makers of this film (Stephen Spielberg & Robert
Zemeckis) did all kinds of cute things, playing with the names of some
of the characters and with issues of time travel.  Some of these are:

a) The mall where Marty McFly (Michael J. Fox) meets Dr. Brown
(Christopher Lloyd) for their time travel experiment is called the
Twin Pines Mall.  Dr. Brown comments that ol' farmer Peabody used
to own all of the land, and he grew pines there.  When Marty goes
back in time, he runs over and knocks down a pine tree.  When he
comes back to the mall at the end of the film (BACK TO THE FUTURE)
the sign at the mall now identifies the mall as the Lone Pine Mall,
reflecting the fact that Marty had changed the present (1985) by
his trip to the past (1955).

b) Farmer Peabody's son is named Sherman. Sherman was the name of
the little boy time traveler in one segment of Jay Ward's cartoon
show, "The Rocky & Bullwinkle Show."  The dog who owned his time
machine was named (surprise) Mr. Peabody.


12. What role did Jamie Lee Curtis play in THE ADVENTURES OF
    BUCKAROO BANZAI ACROSS THE 8TH DIMENSION?

She played Buckaroo's mother in a flashback sequence.  The sequence
was cut, and so does not appear in the final, release version.

13. When is George Lucas going to make more STAR WARS films?  What will they
    be about??

There had been a rumor that another STAR WARS film would come out soon ...
maybe in 1992 for the 15th anniversary of the first film.  Presumably,
this would have been the first of a trilogy which will depict the years
before the three films that have been made.  (Therefore they have been
known as Chapters 1, 2, & 3.  This is consistent with the labeling of the
films that have come out as 4, 5, & 6.  Of course, at least some of these
labels were added post-release).  Lucas has, in the past, claimed that
there will someday maybe be a series of three trilogies: The three
already made, the three preceding these events (see above) and three
that take place after the three films that are already made.

However, all of the information about new films coming out does not go
much beyond the rumor stage--as the fact that 1992 is here and the next
film is not.  We'll believe it when we see it.

[The latest is that "Entertainment Tonight" and some Los Angeles local
news stations announced Lucas will be releasing the next trilogy once
a year starting in 1997.  Again, we'll believe it when we see it.]

Lots of books, comics and other stories that have been released are
supposedly *not* directly related to the planned films.  These were
additional merchandising items.

(And by the way, the first STAR WARS film was originally released as
just "STAR WARS"; it was only in re-release that it was entitled "STAR
WARS EPISODE IV: A NEW HOPE."  The other two were always labeled
"EPISODE  V" and "EPISODE VI.")

14. In OUTLAND and TOTAL RECALL, astronauts exposed to vacuum
    promptly explode.  In 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY, a few seconds' exposure
    to vacuum doesn't bother one at all.  Which is right?

This hasn't occurred in real life, but there have been experiments where
animals, or parts of a person's body, were exposed to vacuum; these
experiments happened before any of these films were made.  2001 was right;
OUTLAND and TOTAL RECALL ignored the known facts.  A full discussion of
this can be found in the sci.space FAQL.  (Discussions of whether TOTAL
RECALL is a dream or not are not pertinent to the question of vacuum, but
since the film is often mentioned in this context, it is included here.)

15. What does "FTL" mean?

"FTL" means "faster than light."

16. I was told that the director's cut of DUNE was seven hours long,
    and did a much better job of portraying the novel.  Where can I
    find it?

As Jerry Boyajian ([e-mail]) explains (hopefully for the last
time [but of course it wasn't]):

There is *no* "director's cut" of DUNE of *any* length.  The existence
of one is a complete myth.  Perhaps when Lynch was cutting the film
originally, there existed such a cut, but if it isn't long gone by now,
it's most likely an untimed work print and not in any sort of releasable
form.

*IF* David Lynch were inclined, and *IF* Dino DeLaurentiis were inclined
(and *IF* his organization wasn't bankrupt), and *IF* the scrap footage
is sitting in a vault somewhere, Lynch could probably reconstruct his
original cut, but all three (or four) of those are mighty big "ifs".

No such cut exists on video, no such cut exists in any final film print.
[There is also no truth to the rumor that there was a European version
that was 4 hours long.]

There exists only one version of the film that's longer than the
original theatrical release, and that was the expanded version made for
television syndication, and it's maybe 50 minutes longer than the
original.  But it certainly can't be claimed to be a "director's cut"
because not only did Lynch not get involved in cutting it, he
disapproved of it so thoroughly that he had his name removed as both
writer and director.

I have a large number of film reference books, both genre-specific and
general.  I follow a number of film and video magazines, and so forth.
I've heard and read detailed descriptions of different cuts of various
films including BLADE RUNNER, BRAZIL, LEGEND, HIGHLANDER, et alia.  I've
read and heard first-hand descriptions by people I know of such longer
versions, or I've seen listings for them as import laserdiscs.  But I've
never heard nor read of any definite, substantiated, unquestionable
existence of a version of DUNE, either in commercial release or floating
around in collectors' hands, that is longer than the 190-minute TV
version.